Take a car with an internal combustion engine and replace everything that is needed for an electric car. Now you have a no-nonsense car.
Instead, we have a rolling data center that feels like a smartphone.
you’re starting too far down the line
most vehicles nowadays are gimmicks
the real question is why can’t we get a simple economical vehicle and not unrepairable subcription-based spyware on wheels with dangerous features, regardless of engine type
You’re starting too far down the line.
Most products and services nowadays are gimmicks.
The real question is why can’t we get a simple good product and not inequitable take-it-or-leave it bullshit with delusional prices, regardless of where.
I mean when it comes to price it’s because the US banned chinese car companies. If BYD was allowed to sell here it would destroy these overpriced domestic manufacturers. They’re still annoyingly “smart” but they’re atleast not expensive as all hell.
Cars getting more expensive is in all car companies’ interests.
They’re getting cheaper actually. The gigantic touchscreen is cheaper than a bespoke interior design with physical buttons for every model.
Of course that’s not reflected in the price
cheaper for the car maker, not for the end consumer.
That’s one part of the system.
My FIL has a 2021 Smart ForFour EV that’s as barebones as it gets. No screen, buttons and knobs for the climate control, popout rear windows AND an actual key you have to put into an actual hole.
It also looks like manufacturers are catching on and making EVs for normal people. Renault. Kia and Hyundai all have nice selections plus some of the Chinese models from Leap and BYD.
So it’s definitely getting better on the EV front.
They do. Or least they sometimes do. I drive a Kia Soul EV. It’s… a Kia Soul with an electric motor and battery instead of all the internal combustion stuff.
KIA is one of the worst offenders regarding continuous surveillance and then selling the data to third parties.
A tip for others:
To ensure your driving data (like braking habits or speed metrics) is completely decoupled from third-party data brokers and insurance exchanges:
• App Settings: Open the Kia Access mobile app, navigate to Account Settings / Privacy, and opt out of all data-sharing programs (specifically anything tied to “Driver Score” or Usage-Based Insurance
You lost me at “App” I would rather ride a pedal bike than drive a car that has a fucking app.
Haven’t souls been discontinued?
Yeah. I was merely noting that there’s a precedent for “normal-car-but-with-EV-stuff-instead.” It’s a shame that the Soul EV was given such a limited distribution. It’s easily my favorite car I’ve ever owned.
These definitely exist. They are typically referred to as ‘compliance cars’ - i.e. the manufacturer is obligated, usually by regulations, to produce an EV, but they don’t want to spend money designing a new platform for it - so they take an existing model, rip out the engine, cram a motor and batteries wherever they will fit and call it good. Examples: Volkswagen eGolf, Fiat 500e, Mercedes B Class EV. Ford Focus Electric…
However, doing this means you are constrained to the shape of the combustion vehicle it is based on. So the aerodynamics may not be optimal to get the best range, you may have a transmission tunnel taking up space in the interior that is no longer necessary, directly swapping the position of the engine and the motor/inverter means you lose the opportunity to repurpose the front of the car for additional storage - ultimately it ends up compromised in one way or another.
If on the other hand you design the platform from the ground up to handle an electric drivetrain then all of these points can be taken into account.
(And regarding cars in general becoming rolling computers: this is not an EV specific issue, unfortunately.)
So three issues.
An ICE drivetrain is a certain size and shape- you have a big lump of engine under the hood, a fat cigar of a transmission under the center of the car, a gas tank in the back, etc.
An EV drivetrain has a VERY DIFFERENT size and shape- the entire battery and drive system is essentially a skateboard on top of which you can build the rest of the car.So you can’t just take an ICE car and swap out the ICE for batteries and motor. The whole car needs a redesign. And if you’re making the car for modern, tech-savvy buyers, why would you make a boring old low-tech car?
Second- EVERY car is turning into a rolling datacenter like a smartphone. Try to buy a base model car with no screen and manual windows or whatever- it doesn’t exist anymore in many brands. Automakers go for the high profit items, and that’s NOT the base models.
Third- a lot of the tech is now mandatory. Backup cameras, and soon driver attention monitoring among other things.
Sad thing is- I think there’s a demand for it, if the price is right. If getting rid of most of the tech dropped $10-20k off the sticker price I think whoever tried it would sell millions. I’m not sure you’re allowed to anymore though.
Seems like Slate can get by with everything removed but airbags. And the price is right.
And the price is right.
Starting at $25k, it’s really not a great price :/. Seems like it’ll be hard to compete with options like the Ford Fathom. EVs aren’t as expensive as they used to be.
I love the Slate, and I hope to own one someday, but I’d probably shop for one that’s a few years old.
I was super interested in the Slate until I realized it can’t tow shit. I don’t need anything crazy. An old S10 tows plenty for me. But not being able to tow a thing and being a truck is just a no go for me.
If the Fathom is 20k but has all the spyware we’ve come to expect from major manufacturers, I’d still buy the Slate. It annoys me that Bezos is involved, but I’d swallow that for some privacy in a new vehicle.
Yeah that’s understandable. I pay more for auto insurance because I don’t give them my data, so I get that. Hopefully this niche market will be big enough for Slate to survive.
Driving a kia e-niro. There’s nothing gimmicky about it except for the melody that plays when you start the car. Everything else is pretty much down to earth regular car stuff. And with a price below 40k, in 2021, I think it wasn’t even that expensive for a EV.
EV have hit 25k now. I think to hit 15k they’ll be throwing out these gimmicks with gusto. Gimmicks are to show off the price
Dacia Spring ?
Dacia is usually pretty much bare bones
You should check Chevy’s lineup. They’re pretty ok, the truck is expensive, but what truck isn’t?
Does the word “car” mean something different in the USA?
“Car” in America is any passenger vehicle, it seems.
Yes, I should have been more specific. So many trucks and mini-vans in the answers.
Sadly, yes.
genuinely so hyped for this
After growing up with one, I’d rather walk blindfolded on a freeway than drive a Chevy.
In ICE cars the base models/brands are no nonsense and you get more of gimmicks as you move up the pricelist. EVs start much higher on the pricelist so they have to include some gimmicks by default to not feel a total ripoff.
In Europe Volkswagen has 3 brands that sell cars built on same platform but they are positioned in three market segments. This made sense for ICE because pricing and features progression worked while parts were shared. Now their EV lineup cost basically the same across all brands because the baseline is so high.
There are those cars, of course. But they are less common in your country.
In the home electronics store I nearly asked if they had any TVs that weren’t smart, nearly.
The first company that is able to commodify modular drop-in BEV replacements for ICE vehicles would make a fortune:
Battery packs shaped to slot into engine bays, transmission tunnels and fuel tank cavities.
Individual motors directly into your preferred wheel wells (FWD? RWD? AWD? 4WD? whatever you like).
Drop-in ECU to interface with the existing chassis.
The sort of thing that someone mechanically minded could knock out in their own garage over a weekend or two, or you could get done at a professional shop in a day.
Imagine taking your favourite silhouette, and giving it exactly the range and performance you desire - at the fraction of the cost of a new EV.
There are plenty of places you can do a conversion of older cars to electric. Universal drop in conversions are close to impossible, though, since every manufacturer has its own proprietary footprint that they change every few years.
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So you acknowledge it doesnt offer value equivalent to what you paid?
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The gimmick on wheels
I test drove quite many models when Musk did the hitler salute thing to get rid of it, and my conclusion was that the rest were even more gimmicky. Hyundais were close, but unfortunately I need the boot space their models didn’t provide.
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lacks physical controls
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blinding LED headlights
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spyware
yeah, that’s totally what we’re looking for
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